zrs70

"Shtup" basically mean to screw.

When I joined FT, the topics seemed to focus on how to get the best bang for the buck. Today, many of the posts seem to be about how the airline owes us all the time (extra miles put into the account, compensation issues, etc.) Have others noticed this gradual shift?

Are we devolving into airliners.net or untied.com?

lucky9876coins

With the growth of the FT community and the fact that it's open to everyone I think it is an inevitable shift, if only because of the addition of members. While I haven't been around FT forever, I always remember reading "How much compensation am I entitled to?" threads, etc. I think the fact that it's so much bigger today would be among the reasons, and I really don't feel there's a shift in the core of what FT is...

Just my two cents.

MileageAddict

You joined in 2000, I have been around since 1998. I understand what you are talking about. I think part of the reason for your observation is airline service has taken a huge dive post-9/11.

jan_az

I guess this is going to be a "trip down memory lane thread".

I remember

--- How to do a status challenge
--- Where can we all get together
---Oh I have something you need - here you go
maybe a year later that person would realize that they had something I needed- but quid pro quo it wasnt.

"So yes IMO it has changed

alliance

I've experienced all of those in the last few months... but I hear what you are saying. I think it is more an issue of the noise far exceeding the signal. But the signal is still here.

Cholula

While this is an interesting topic, the CommunityBuzz! mods have discussed it and feel it's probably a better fit for the MilesBuzz! forum.

Please continue to follow and contribute at it's new home.

Thanks.


______________________

Jenbel, Cholula and chrissxb

CommunityBuzz! Co-Moderators

sbrower

It depends, in part, on which forum you are in. But I agree that there is an unfortunate trend toward pushing for compensation, but I also agree that airline changes have been unfortunate since 9/11.

monitor

The main difference that I have observed is that at the beginning (and I have been reading it from the beginning), it seemed to me that there were about equal numbers of business travelers and leisure travelers on this board. Now, it appears that the vast majority of the posters, especially the American members, are predominantly leisure travelers.

These groups have different areas on which they focus and are looking for different things out of FF programs, but interesting and insightful posts are not exclusive to either group. And altho it may seem that redundant and just plain unnecessary posts largely come from the leisure group, that is only because that group is so much larger now. I don't think that either has per capita any monopoly on that sort of stuff.

JerryFF

I think it's also partly a reflection on a shift in society as a whole over the past 10 years - I teach at a big university and we call this the "entitlement generation." Everyone seems to think they are entitled to so much that we used to have to work for and considered special rewards or perks or bonuses.

FF programs have now been around for more than 25 years and many people who do not remember or know the days before FF programs existed see them as an entitlement rather than the marketing tool that they are. When the airlines make changes, they feel as if their entitlement is being taken away or reduced.

pinniped

I don't disagree with anything posted so far - but I also think the airlines themselves have contributed to a shift in mentality. Their own policies serve to establish an almost-confrontational relationship with their clients (us). I'm not even talking about things out of their control, like the TSA. I'm talking about fundamental customer service, problem-solving, flexibility, thinking, and general mindset of the employees as they interact with clients. It is all very rules-based, adversarial, and underpins a culture that we, the clients, are somehow a nuisance.

Anyone remember seeing that "No waivers, no favors" internal email that some airline sent out to all of its employees? (I wish I had the link - I know I saw it here and perhaps also at F**kedcompany.com.) I can't imagine in a million years sending that kind of email to my team about how we interact with our client partners on a daily basis. It's classless and absurd.

It's not even that I ever really *got* any waivers or favors - it's more about the culture and empowering people to think and solve problems. That's gone, and as such we are now reduced to exploiting systems to try and gain some sort of advantage over 'The Man'. Why does air travel have to be us vs. The Man? That's sad... It does not have to be this way because of security procedures at airports - that's a bogus excuse.

Oddly enough, the one airline that seems to "get it" is Southwest. No, I'm not a big fan of the product itself and don't fly them often, but whenever I have to fly with them (and especially if my plans change or I encounter irregular ops), I feel like they deal fairly with me. It's more than I can say for most.

BearX220

The relationship between customers and airlines has long been an adversarial chess game. In the pre-9/11 days when Gordon Bethune charged me $2300 for a last-minute coach ticket, he took advantage of me because he could. When a crafty mileage run vaults a customer into the Platinum zone for $600, he's taking advantage of the airline right back.

What's changed on FT is the relationships between customer types. Adepts sneer at amateurs. New contributors get flamed. You have greedy compensation chasers lining up against FTers with raging cases of Stockholm Syndrome (e.g. irrational sympathy for their captors) who can defend or rationalize the most egregious corporate acts. (Bizarrely, these defenses grow more fervent as airline service quality degenerates and the horror stories get worse. I think there must be a great academic study in that.)

I suppose this is inevitable as the FT base balloons from a core of adepts to reflect the public at large. To me the flying public has always been composed of two categories of people: those who understand the aircraft cabin is a a social community, and act to make it livable... and those who maximize their own "rights" or advantage at the expense of the community. FT used to be weighted toward the first category; today it is weighted toward the second.

voop

I am, for once, actually happy to have to disagree with another FTer. About a month and a half ago, a fellow FTer (whom I didn't know in advance, btw.) PMed me, since he thought that based on my postings he had something I would appreciate. Something which is usually traded on CC against something-of-non-trivial-value, but which he offered for free to me since he thought I'd appreciate it / put it to good use...just like that.

So (and I am a relative newbie as an active poster / registered user on FT) that "old-time-spirit" is still around. Maybe diluted, but it's still around in some good people......

cepheid

I have to agree. A few months ago, an FTer with whom I had essentially never interacted before sent me a UA e-cert. A legitimate one. Out of the blue, without me even thinking about asking, for basically no reason other than he thought I could use it.

There's definitely a lot of noise and disgruntlement around here, for sure... it waxes and wanes depending on the times. But, there's still plenty of advocation and general camaraderie, IMHO.

bk3day

Add me to the list of recipients of helpful, cost-saving info, PMed by another heretofore, unknown to me FTer! ^

That kind FTer sent it unsolicited after reading a post of mine and thought he could help.

fwiw, if anyone ever feels a bit down on FT, for any reason, I strongly suggest you head over to Community Buzz and read the relatively recent "Medical Emergency" thread. Your faith in FT and FTers will soon be restored.

the_happiness_store

Personally, I was stunned when I saw that people on CC were trading 3P nominations. I guess it's why I am not rich. I justed gifted the two I had to people who seemed to be genuine with the hope that they would act likewise in the future.

I do not expect the perks and benefits but I have no trouble asking for them. If denied then the case is closed.