Carolinian

It appears from my looking at both paid and award TATL tickets originating in Europe, that DL is now routinely charging over $300 in taxes and fees. If the same flights are booked originating in the US, the taxes and fees are around $100.

All of the flights I have checked have been from eastern Europe, and I have either called or used a computer based in Europe to check.

European-based travellers are clearly being discriminated against by DL, and it is just inexcusable. I have allerted the travel office of my organization to this scam, and also allerted local friends who work for organizations which pay for their travel. Getting the word out to our organizations will help keep them from being cheated by DL.

In my case, I put the miles I earn these days on NW, so only the miles I have remaining from my days as a DL GM are impacted, but it means DL will cheat me if I try to use my miles for travel ex-Europe. That really burns me up, and is a huge devaluation of Skymiles for anyone based in Europe.

I am glad that Rob Borden motivated me a few years ago to comp over to NW. I just booked a TATL award ticket for next summer using Worldperks, ex-OTP, and the taxes were only $81 compared to the $332 that DL wanted for the same city pairs.

I wonder if they will follow up with doing the same thing on tickets ex-US?

This is a huge reason those of us who fly NW need to work hard, complain to regulators and Congressmen, or whatever is necessary to ''Keep NW Our NW''

soitgoes

If a) the DOT let them and b) their competitors did the same.
In Europe, a) doesn't apply and b) is true.
I agree it's unfriendly, and, as someone currently residing in Europe, I don't like it one bit.

jwhite4

The definitive way (if possible) would be to reserve award tickets on DL and NW, but get a breakdown of the exact taxes. Then you can compare exactly what they are charging for, and the amounts.

Is there a separate Skyteam award desk? If so, they'd have access to award from both airlines (also CO). If one tax was $x on NW, and $xx on DL, they might be able to either explain why, or call DL and find out why.

Jeff

Carolinian

I am trying to alert other travelers to DL's actions, and am posting this info on three timeshare related sites, on two of which I am a moderator, and one other travel related site I sometimes check. Unfortunately only one is a Europe-based site, but two others have a fair number of Europe-based posters.

It would be good if others want to be proactive and help get the word on DL's shananigans on other travel-related websites, especially if they are frequented by Europeans or those based in Europe.

Gargoyle

Is the base ticket price the same? I recall comparing AZ tix once on the US and Italian sites. The end price was about the same (a few cents different due to euro exchange rates) but a very different breakdown between base price and taxes.

For example, from the U.S. might have been $750 + $50 tax and from Italy might have been the Euro equivalent of $650 + $150 tax.

KCnAtl

Personally, I think your thread title is misleading.
Taxes and fees are assessed because some governmental or airport authority REQUIRED the airline to do so.
The fees and taxes are pass through costs - meaning DL collects them then remits them to the taxing entity. It's not like DL is pocketing the money.

The two components in calculating taxes are the basis and the tax rules and rates. Tax collected = Basis * Rate. The only piece of that that DL has any control over is the basis and even then the tax authority usually has some rules on valuation.

I do not pretend to even begin to understand the labyrinth of taxes and fees that are assessed here in the US with regard to air travel, much less Europe but here are some possible scenarios:

If the NW award is on a NW European partner airline, then it is possible (even likely IMO) that the tax rates are different for a European carrier as opposed to a US based carrier.

It is also possible that NW somehow calculates award ticket value differently than DL - though I suspect this is not the case.

It is also possible that NW awards are defined so that some fees and taxes are absorbed by NW. In that case, it is simply a difference in the way the awards programs are structured.

None of the above scenarios suggests that DL is somehow 'cheating' European pax.

I suggest you call the DL awards desk and ask them to provide you the basis they are using for tax calculation purposes then have them explain each of the taxes and fees that are being assessed.

Call NW awards and do the same. Only then will you be able to make a determination of whether or not DL is cheating people.

KCnAtl

See post #6 on this thread.
Might be a good idea to have some actual facts before you start tossing out words like "cheating" and "shenanigans"

Carolinian

Government tax entities are not going to charge different airlines different taxes, now are they? When DL's taxes on both paid and award tickets from different countries are over $200 higher, something smells. Also, the total tax on a roundtrip is going to be the same regardless of where the flight originates, now isn't it. Sorry, but your defense of DL's policies fails.

Besides on several I checked, both the fare and ''tax'' were higher from Europe than from the US.

The first time I encountered this, when I was quoted a whopping $332 for taxes and fees, I DID ask why they were so high and the phone rep was real vague, saying she couldn't figure it out exactly. I asked if they had put on a fuel surcharge and she did say she was certain that was not it.

Gargoyle

On the paid tickets, was the base price before taxes the same? Were the routing and conneting airports and times exactly the same?

KCnAtl

So far the only fact I see is that DL is charging $332. Your other arguments have no facts, just supposition on your part. For example, if I depart London, I will be charged a new departure tax (hefty I might add) that is designed to actively discourage flying in England and protect the planet from pollution. I don't see this tax if I fly INTO London.

Taxes are amazingly inconsistent, sometimes for the stupidest of reasons.

My earlier hypotheses were not designed to defend DL - only illustrate there are likely valid reasons for the taxes and fees you are seeing.

In any event, I am supposing as are you, but you are the one on a rant here and I am only suggesting that you get your facts straight before you go on a worldwide mission of libeling a respected company when you don't know what you are talking about.

And if you think something smells, then consider this - if you open the refrigerator and get a foul odor, check the tuna fish salad before you indict the Cheez-Whiz.

3Cforme

NW will apply taxes and fees according to its Worldperks rules and applicable law in country of ticketing or origin.

DL will do the same according to its SkyMiles rules. We all agreed to the rules - and the airlines' unilateral right to change the rules - when we signed up for the FF programs.

That doesn't mean DL is 'cheating'. We understand you don't like these rules.

As for different rules between U.S. and European origin or FF residence address? Yes, it happens. In many transactions, across many industries.

YVR Cockroach

Could be fuel surcharges. Some airlines add these in the base fare (NW), others add them as fees.

soitgoes

That's what it is. DL is now assessing fuel surcharges on top of *some* award tickets (at least those with AF flight segments) that originate in Europe.

For revenue tickets, you shouldn't just compare the "taxes/fees" amounts but the total cost amounts. If NW has a 400€ fare with 100€ taxes and DL has a 250€ fare with 250€ taxes and surcharges, there really isn't a difference in end effect.

KCnAtl

I could take needed lessons from you in brevity.
Well said.

Carolinian

I specifically asked if these were fuel surcharges and was told that they were not. Also, none of these routings involved AF operated flights (although two flights on one routing were AF codeshares operated by TAROM) only one routing involved travel through France. Curiously the NW routing with the lower tax DID involve an AF flight and travel through France.

Again, the paid flights I looked at had slightly higher fares combined with MUCH higher taxes, the all-in prices were not in the same ballpark.