psychtobe

the recovery line moved four feet in 20 minutes and is hundreds of people long. so i gave up and booked on AS home the first available flight which isn't till Sunday.

i haven't given up on this flight yet as we have very important business to attend to in DTW. But The total lack of communication is ridiculous. i've been at the airport for 10 hours, how long am i supposed to just sit here with no communication?

emma dog

When flying AAA-XXX-BBB, you can't provide your own transportation to XXX without first getting approval from the airline. The usual answer is a hard "no," but I'm wondering how much leeway DL is giving its front line employees to make stuff work.

lindros2

Interesting that this would have never happened if Delta didn't replace Cylance with Crowdstrike for questionable reasons.
If Delta folks are seriously lurking, I’d wonder about an answer.
But as a public-traded company, they have 48 hours under SEC rules to make up some boilerplate “we don’t know but we’re looking into it”…

ATOBTTR

There's significantly more leeway to do something like this in IROPS, especially major IROPS.

DrMilano

We all know the reason why and subsequently Delta will claim “force majeure” as an out/excuse from paying out millions in passenger claims. Penny wise, pound foolish. Probably used the savings for the Delta One lounge construction/hospitality cost.

emma dog

Can someone explain to the non-IT guy what the reasons are? But also, how could/would DL (and UA, AA, major banks, hospitals, and a stock exchange) have known this "would" happen?

jetsfan92588

What rule is that? Not saying you're wrong, and I'm familiar with a rule that covers funds and investment companies, but didn't know it applies to all publicly traded companies.

gm1955

I was able to do that once ~2008 when first leg was cancelled for “equipment” on the Sunday after Thanksgiving with flawless weather.

Took almost 2.5 hours (while driving to MSP hoping we could make it work) but it was one of only a few cancelled flight that day and no coexisting IT problem.

Same this last Jan during the ultra cold spell middle of the month, but was easier in 2024. Got refunded the value of the unused segment

DLASflyer

From the travel waiver:
Covering meals and accommodations: Meal vouchers and hotel accommodations are being provided to impacted customers.

xliioper

Whether it's considered force majeure doesn't make much difference in liability. It only requires them to provide you with overnight lodging and some meal vouchers. Even EU261 doesn't mandate that airlines are liable to pay for someone's $10K first night hotel bill in cases like this.

lindros2

I don’t want to lurk into OMNI territory, but this is simply a trust issue.
Everyone now trusts Crowdstrike and allowed it to update without testing first. Laziness? Maybe. IT staff spread thin and now 6000 miles away? Yep.
Crowdstrike claims to use “AI” but their software agent is the same as 30 years ago. It has “content” (signature) and actual agent software (user interface, configuration, prevent shutdown/disable, and other stuff).
Somehow the content update triggered something in Windows that killed the whole system (I had this with a video game recently due to a memory violation), and upon rebooting, Windows continued to have major issues. Like fail to load over and over. No way to remotely fix catastrophic failure.
This is almost identical to the SQL Slammer update McAfee released in 2003, and the infamous “McAfee DAT 5958 in 2010.

It’s all related to the updates to Form 8-K.
Items 1.05, and now Regulation S-K item 106. It’s my life.

Check out VF Corp, Okta, Clorox, MarineMax, 23andMe (evasive AND blamed customers/users like all of us… and like Snowflake did) and many others since last October. Honestly, the disclosures have been minimal, and many orgs have NOT done it, claiming and fearing attackers will use it to do more damage (or regulators will see how crap they were, insurers will refuse to pay out, or… lawyers will sue).

https://www.sec.gov/newsroom/press-releases/2023-139

https://www.cybersecuritydive.com/ne...t-descriptions

MSPeconomist

IIRC there's some guideline that in severe IROPs, you can change the departure/arrival airport to another one within 300 miles. This might cover many of the situations where the passenger would prefer to drive to the connecting airport when the first segment has been badly delayed or cancelled.

lindros2

This gets into third party risk management territory and culpability for IT system failures, like log4j and regreSSHion.
less classic EU261 and IRROPS around MX.

Not sure if the Boeing MAX thing, or Amadeus, SABRE, or similar IT failures would be case law for this.

Again, having worked with Delta and had the door slammed when they ripped out Cylance and replaced with Crowdstrike, this was preventable…. And schadenfreude.

photojojo

Yeeaaaaa but I'd have to know, like, now if I need to make the 7 hour drive to ATL for the connecting flight to AUA. Fingers crossed everything goes off according to plan.

tennreb

Cost of for 4 D1 tickets was about $28k. Only two were rebooked in D1. First night of hotel rooms is about $10k total, but really only out $8k since I’m going to make it and occupy one room. Delta and FT mantra is ‘you get what you pay for’ but what if you don’t? I paid $28k to get 4 family members to Venice on an easy, direct flight from ATL in comfort. Despite spending $28k, that didn’t happen. Do you ‘get what you pay for’?