This is all I needed, thanks!

P.S. - sometimes the goal is not necessarily to gain the most amount of award miles.

 

I'm currently a UA frequent flyer based out of LAX, but will be moving with my family to LHR. Naturally oneworld makes the most sense out of LHR but I'm trying to decide if it makes more sense to join BA or AA. My main goals are lounge access and free long haul business class tickets for my family (either booking outright or through upgrading PE fares).

Some basic info about my expected travel / spend:

- Two to three paid business class flights per year through work to MIA or Latin America: total estimated spend $7-10k
- One to two personal flights to the USA per year in premium economy: total estimated spend $3-4k
- Two to three personal flights to Europe per year in economy: total estimated spend $1-2k

- Natural credit card spend: ~$30k/year

Based on all of that it seems like I could easily reach AA Platinum in my first year and Platinum Pro in my second year. Maybe even Platinum Pro my first year if I get an AA credit card. On the BA side it seems like I'd be stuck with Silver unless I went out of my way to add additional legs to my trips or do tier point runs, neither of which is really appealing to me. So for elite status the win seems to go to AA.

It seems like I would be earning 8-9 miles per $ on AA, while with BA it would be only 8 avios per �. Again this is a win for AA in terms of mileage earnings.

Am I missing anything here? Based on the numbers alone it seems like a no brainer to pick AA, but that feels wrong being based out of LHR. Will I be at any disadvantage by picking AA? Thanks in advance for any help here.

 

Missing a lot.
How long in London for? A few months/years or for ever. If only for 1~2 years may not be worth the effort.
Many airlines from UK airports. Not just BA. And other airports in London region. LGW LCY STN

Free long haul business class tickets is not gong to happen. BAEC is notorious for award cash surcharges. If an AA award on BA the same surcharges apply. Unless using an AA SWU from memory an AA upgrade has $350 fee plus ff miles. As well as real taxes & regulatory fees. UK has the infamous APD,

BA mid-top status will give AS-AA lounge access in USA for USA domestic flights, where as AA status will not. International flights have different access rules. Can be important for some.

Avios is used by BA-IB-IE-QR Qatar and now AY. Avios, but not status, can be moved between some of these ffp's . Consider IB

BA or Oneworld airlines may not be the best price-schedule-routes for London to EU. Better to fly based on schedule~price. EU is small.
For Paris~France or Belgium taking the train from London may be better point to point when considering time and cost to get to/from airports depending on where you will live.

Will you be able to get ff miles/avois/points from non flying activities? UK credit card?

 

Do you currently have any elite status in Mileage Plus? If so, applying for a BA status match before the May 7 deadline is a no-brainer. Details in this thread:

BA Status Match Offer for US/Canada Residents

BA Avios can usually provide better value than AAdvantage miles for trips between London and the rest of Europe. Conversely, AAdvantage miles can provide better value for intercontinental travel, as long as you are not redeeming for travel where BA is the carrier on the long-haul segment.

 

Thanks for all this info - very helpful. The intention is for the move to be permanent but obviously things can change as parents age and kids go to university. I'd guess at a minimum we'll be there for 10 years or so. We will be moving to SW London so LHR will be the most convenient airport for us - probably not much travel out of LGW, STN or LTN unless the fares are significantly different / more convenient.

I suppose I misspoke when I said 'free' business class - I understand there will be fees but my intention is to use miles/avios to get my family in business class at a significantly reduced price. On UA for example we would buy PE fares and use miles to upgrade into business class which generally worked pretty well (though not always guaranteed). I did have a look at random dates for LHR-LAX on both AA and BA, and BA's website was saying 'no availability' while AA was showing business class availability for ~230k miles. That seems like a win for the AA program?

As for CC spend, my intention was to continue using a US based credit card with zero foreign transaction fees since the rewards are much better. I can use my parents' US address to keep the card. Currently I have a UA card but I'm open to switching to an AA card or maybe CSR or Amex Platinum if the value is there. In SoCal our current natural spend is around $30k/year so I'd guess it will be similar in London but hard to say for sure given all the differences in cost of living.

Thanks this is a good shout, I have UA Gold status so might as well get free BA Silver. In terms of value of points - that's good to know thanks. I am fine using other airlines besides BA for my personal travel. My main goal is to extract as much value out of the ~$7-10k of spend I will be doing for my work trips which will most likely be on BA flights (except maybe MIA) since our corporate travel program forces non-stop when available.

 

A few observations:

1. If using a dollar-denominated, no foreign-transaction-fee credit card overseas, you need to be vigilant to ensure that merchants process the charge in foreign currency (GBP in the UK), and do not process the charge in USD, using "dynamic currency conversion." Details here:

https://www.investopedia.com/dynamic...rency%20(CPC).

("Dynamic Currency Conversion (DCC): What It Is and How to Avoid It")

2. The benefit of using AAdvantage miles on trans-Atlantic award flights on AA metal is that you avoid the high cash surcharges that would be charged if you used Avios on trans-Atlantic flights operated by AA or BA, or if you used AAdvantage miles on trans-Atlantic flights operated by BA. But AA often charges a lot of miles for premium-cabin trans-Atlantic flights on AA metal, as AAdvantage awards on AA metal are now dynamically-priced. So in a sense you have to pick your poison: more AA miles but less cash to fly AA; fewer AA miles but more cash to fly BA; or fewer BA miles (Avios) and more cash to fly. (You will not often find AA premium-cabin trans-Atlantic award seats available with Avios.)

3. If you do decide to collect AAdvantage miles rather than Avios, one of the ways that you can sometimes get better value when flying between Europe and the U.S. is by starting or ending your trip in a city other than London, and then connecting in London. That avoids the high U.K. APD when heading to the U.S., and could cost fewer AAdvantage miles too, since any award itinerary which involves at least one flight on a partner carrier prices as a fixed-price "partner" award with AAdvantage. But with young children, starting or ending in a city other than London might be difficult -- unless you wanted to visit the other city for a few days anyway.

4. If you plan to book AA flights through a travel agent and hope to earn AAdvantage miles and Loyalty Points from those flights, make sure that the agent is one which AA will recognize for AAdvantage earnings. Details here:

https://thepointsguy.com/news/americ...ooking-direct/

("Big changes to American Airlines program delayed, but still coming: AA wants you booking direct")

5. Finally, if you do decide to credit to BA instead of AA, you can still earn Avios and BA Tier Points toward BAEC elite status on AA flights. But to keep BAEC Silver (or Gold) status, you must fly at least four "qualifying flights" in an earnings period, in addition to the Tier Points earned. Flights on AA metal can be qualifying flights if and only if they are purchased with a BA codeshare flight number (i.e., BA XXXX, operated as AA YYYY).

Good luck!

 

Something else not yet mentioned, if you decide on AA vs. BA, they also have a paid status match program that would match you to Platinum. For status benefits though I'd go with BA Silver over AA Platinum since AA domestic upgrades for Platinum won't be common and BA Silver gives you access to lounges on domestic tickets. The main advantage to AA would be year 2 when you could make PPro, you'd get 2 SWUs as a choice award and access to the First lounge in LHR T5 (though many people complain about it, it's without a doubt better than the business lounges). It'd also get you the CX First lounge in T3 which I'd say is the best of the lot in that terminal but there are good arguments for the QF lounge too.

You've mentioned spend on the AA credit card, unless it's going to bump your status level, I wouldn't use it as a primary card, the benefits other than AAdvantage miles and LPs is pretty bad (zero travel insurances, no rental car CDW, etc.... I guess that's the Citi version, I'm unfamiliar with the Barclay's one). Chase Sapphire cards tend to be superior in every way and the points are quite flexible so you're not tied to OneWorld. I'd also look at the Capital One Venture X, it is pretty solid too and has great earnings ratios. Loyalty Lobby just did a good piece on the Amex Plat, and it does have great benefits and insurance (note Amex CDW isn't valid in Ireland, Chase's is, I don't know about CapOne.) but their spend ratio is generally inferior.

When considering long haul flights out of the UK, that APD stings on premium tickets so many people use DUB as a jumping off point instead. AA serves DUB and you can use either AA or BA miles on EI flights (EI also earns in both programs on revenue tickets). QR also serves DUB for eastbound long haul travel. With a train connection, BRU can serve the same advantage but France has a quite high premium ticket tax as well.

 

If you want to collect more miles, it seems like AS is the best for BA flights, especially on business class. But you never know what will happen to their program in the future. They seem to have a status match as well. Note that if you deposit your miles into AA, all BA and IB flights will be revenue based, must be booked by their preferred travel agents etc.
If you want to have benefits for your family, I think some credit cards offer companion vouchers but I never explored it. I think they also have some limits to where the departure should be. For example, US cards might restrict you to start your trip in the US etc. I believe BA has AMEX card in the uk with similar features.
If you want a status, BA seems easiest but I don't see much value in collecting BA avios because one can easily transfer it from cc or other programs. However, Avios is useful for London based travelers for direct flights within short distance but I think AS has more or less similar redemption costs.

 

AA EP or AS 100K?

Best Oneworld Frequent Flyer Program for you?
- do you value miles/points (or equivalent) for redemption over gaining status? Currently, no.
- what do you want to use the miles/points for (award, upgrade, hotels, what ever)? AS miles used for booking award tickets. Currently credit all AA flying to AS to make status.
- what sort of flight award is of interest? � First/Business International.
- do you have other ways of earning points in the various programs, e.g. credit cards, shopping, etc? CSR, VentureX, Most major branded hotel cards, AS credit card.

(1) What is most important to you in a FFP?
Upgrades to First Class when flying domestically.

(2) How many miles do you usually fly each year & in what class? How many flights/sectors?
Actual flight miles ~100,000? 2023 was 80 airplanes, work and personal travel. 2024 will be about the same

(3) What types of fares do you usually buy?
On AS, I always purchase MAIN. Since I�m 75K, I can select Premium Cabin seats free at booking. GGUs are basically worthless for any AS flights book. On AA, I usually choose BASIC, since with OWE I can select a Comfort Class Seat and get a free checked bag. If the cost difference is low, sometimes will choose MAIN if the booking class earns more EQMs. Usually end up on a few Southwest flights due schedule.


(4) Can you choose your airlines and/or class of service? Do you travel for work and/or pleasure?

Both. I pay for most of my flights. This is the main reason free domestic upgrades are the most important.


(5) Which routes and airlines do you fly most often?
ANC-SEA-DFW. Other U.S. domestic all over. MIA, TPA, MCO, JAX, CMH, BHM, LAS, MTJ, GJT, DEN, PDX in the last couple years. Hubing out of DFW with American (and Southwest as a backup) pretty much ensures no layovers in the Continental US. Will start flying at least one international trip (vacation) per year on mileage again this year. Have a five-country trip booked with AS mileage upcoming in a couple months. The wife flies international once or twice per year, and I would like to be able to spend miles for her tickets as well.

(6) What is your home airport?
DFW, DAL, ANC


(7) Do you have FFP status of any kind in OW or other airline? What is it? Do you have any miles banked in a FFP?
75K on Alaska since 2016, on track for 100K this year thanks to CC spend. Currently 240K AS miles.


(8) Preferred Airlines? Most common Airlines flown on?
75% AS, 15% AA, 10% Southwest and other.



Having to hit credit card spend to make top tier status is the main reason I am considering changing loyalty programs. Would plan on getting the Citi AA Exec World Elite and the Barclays Silver cards to earn the additional loyalty points needed to make Executive Platinum. Alaska seems to be slowly devaluing their program, and I expect the 100Ks to explode now that they are offering EQMs by spending. Considering switching to the AA DFW-ANC direct if there was a high probability being upgraded. Looking for some Executive Platinums to weigh in on that.

My personal spending on flights averages about $9K per year. 25% of my BIS mileage is work tickets are booked by my employer on AS.

By my math, I need to spend a little over $18,XXX a year on AA flights, or make up the difference with other spending on AA branded credit cards as an AA Executive Platinum to keep Executive Platinum.

If I get the Citi AA Exec World Elite, it looks like it�s good for 20,000 bonus loyalty points. The Barclays Silver looks like it�s good for 15,000 bonus loyalty points, if I spend $50,000 on the card. That�s 85,000, with $50,000 spending on the Barclays Silver card. IF I�m Exec Platinum and I spend $9,000 on tickets at 11 loyalty points per dollar, that�s 99,000. This leaves me to find 16,000 more points to make top status. Should be easy through CC spend or booking a couple hotels through an AA travel portal? I always tought it was a lot harder to make top tier on AA instead of AS, but it looks like it is pretty close.

Also, from looking at international mileage tickets, it seems like AA has a lot more availability than using AS mileage with partner airlines.

 

You've got a pretty interesting scenario.

I do pretty well on AA upgrades as an EXP and I think the customer service on the EXP line is generally great. But I fly a lot of less prime routes, my home town is in Ohio so I do a lot of CMH, CLE, or DAY routes, I go to St. Louis a lot so that's also one I frequent, those are easy upgrades. I believe the only upgrades I've missed when I was on an economy ticket were PIT-ORD, LAX-DFW, and DFW-LAX. But hub to hub upgrades don't seem to be easy and I generally buy first outright on those if I want it.

I have a feeling your ANC flights are difficult, even as EXP. I haven't been there (yet) so can't speak to it personally but I recall a lot of chatter in the UA forum when I was 1K that their ANC route was typically full of paid F oil folks up front, pretty much zero upgrades to be had. I know DFW isn't IAH in terms of oil, but still I imagine that front cabin is a tough one if not buying it. How's your upgrade ratio on SEA-ANC and v.v.?

Since you mention 25% of your flights per year are booked on AS by your employer, a consideration is how they'll earn on AA. AS credits all except basic at 100% of distance (plus your status bonus), AA does not and many fare classes are in the 25-50% range plus EXP bonus. That still "might" be better than you'd earn on AA metal flights based on revenue, or might not be, you have to weigh your average ticket cost vs. distance at the appropriate multiplier if switching your employer funded flights to AA metal is even possible.
AS Credit on AS
AA Credit on AS

In terms of award chart for long haul international, AA beats the heck out of AS since they went distance based. In theory partner availability should be similar if not the same from both programs, but I do believe that QR has some favoritism for AS vs. AA in their availability if that makes any difference. You'll have to look at both carriers non-Alliance partners to see if any are relevant to you or not. I've been able to take advantage of FJ awards from AAdvantage and definitely appreciated they were there.

One thing I also don't know is how the upgrade ratio is for AS elites on AA and AA elites on AS. I have my first ever flight on AS this summer but it's in paid D class, so already up front.

One other thing I can think of that is advantageous about AAdvantage is that as an EXP you get the 120% bonus on all OW flights, where on AS your status bonus is only for AS flights. That can make a huge difference depending on the airline flown, but AS has better multipliers for some premium cabin partner travel... 6 of one, half dozen of the other maybe.

I don't know there's a clear answer for your question, as a global traveler I really like AA's program, but sounds like you're primarily regional aside from some international holidays using miles. The downside of regional / domestic travel is that you don't get lounge benefits but sounds like you plan to make up for that with the Citi Exec card. The Citi card benefits BTW are pretty horrible in the US credit card market, so aside from the Admiral's Club membership and any needed status miles, I wouldn't choose it as my primary spender. It has zero travel insurances on it anymore either, so definitely don't buy travel with it if that coverage is important.

 

I'm almost always upgraded on the DFW-SEA/SEA-DFW leg, and maybe 1/3? on the SEA-ANC/ANC-SEA. I'm keeping a list this year, and going to compare it after I hit the 100K mark.
The later the red eye, the better the odds of upgrade. I was eighth on the list after FC was full last week.

Looking at the mileage cost to fly AA metal to Europe, they look pretty good.

There are some good economy redemptions with QR, that's who I'm flying back from DXB/DOH this summer.
I scored a 30K miles ticket to Europe, including a 3 day stopover in Helsinki on the way there on Finnair as well.

I bought an Alaska Lounge+ Membership last year, but did not renew. The Capital One lounge at DFW is great, and I have the CSR with 3 Priority Pass restaurants in SEA. A long Anchorage layover can be rough, but I have 4 lounge passes a year from status. The Admiral's Club membership includes access to all the Alaska Lounges, so it's like paying $55 less for an Alaska Lounge membership if I get the AA Card. Would not get it unless I was chasing AA status.

 

For that ANC flight, seems to align with what I knew about the UA flight. I bet it's full with a lot of paid by company oil folks. I wouldn't count on elite upgrades on that segment from any airline, and from DFW is a lot more hours in the air if you don't clear. How much more $$ is it to just buy first / business?

That's not normal, AA has dynamic pricing on awards and doesn't release much inventory at saver prices. (the lowest level available). Generally you'd see those mileage levels on IB, BA, or AY but if it's BA you're paying out the rear for their YQ fees, it's not worth it. Find something on IB or AY, I'd never ever redeem AA miles for BA long haul. (and for that matter never would I redeem BA miles for long haul on BA, I'm not keen to pay $500-1000 for an award ticket fee).

Pretty terrible use of miles, but if it's worth it for you then that's your choice. For myself I almost never redeem for economy, but occasionally will do it for travel partners during expensive holiday periods when revenue tickets are 2-3x usual prices.

Sorry to inform you that restaurant use is gone on all US credit card based Priority Passes now, they've all dumped it now, Chase being the most recent. Citi apparently still has it on the legacy Prestige card that isn't available for new applicants, but I do believe that's the only one remaining but unobtainable. C1X, CSR, and Amex all dropped it already.

 

Just made it to Iberia Plata (Silver/OWR).

Have upcoming SNA-ORD-MCO-PHX-SNA (though my ORD Connection is only 40mins, which may prove to be painful if issues arise). Then shouldn't be too difficult to get to IB Oro (Gold/OWS).

Then the decision is whether to fly UA and credit to TK or continue to make it to IB Platino (Platinum/OWE), which I don't think would provide me with much benefit as I am already flying in Biz/First domestically.

 

For domestic, you're right, there's little incremental benefit of OWE vs OWS. If you're already flying domestic first your luggage allowance is already 3x 32kg. The only place I can think of that it would really matter is if you transit JFK frequently where you'd get the SoHo Lounge vs the Greenwich Lounge. I've always been a bit surprised that the AA FL is open to OWS, but unless that changes then non-US based OWS is perfectly fine for domestic US flying.

If you end up doing more overseas travel in the future then I do think OWE has value but within the US you're probably right and better to chase *G via TK, A3, or OZ (though OZ is likely to be short lived)

 

Yea, I was definitely surprised that OWS has access to AA FL. Do you know if that extends to Flagship Dining as well (seemed unclear),

Baggage likely not going to be a big perk for me, I tend to travel with Carry on mostly, maybe if I go international, I'd take a single suitcase.

When I was looking at *A, TK seemed like the best option, while I originally was going to go OZ, it didn't seem to make sense since it may change. And Aegean requires the A3 Metal flights, whereas TK doesn't.

Also I think my company has a Delta Status Match offer, so once I get to OWS (IB Gold, it may be worth matching to a different program if I have a bunch coming up on that alliance. So far I have been selecting AA/AS only, but there are times when DL or UA would be a bigger plane possibly with lie-flat (777/787, or DL1 on 767), vs AA's 737MAX/A321s